From what I'm hearing, I don't like anything I've heard so far...
Top four from each Region no at large in Upper State
Lower State is different, but it all comes down to Region except for one at large and no one seems to know how the at large will be selected.
Pre-determined match ups...
Region One #1 -vs - Region Two #4
Region Three #2 -vs- Region Four #3
NO SEEDING!!!!
Meaning the best teams could meet in round one or round two.
Ten Games - Five rounds of Playoffs ( 32 team bracket )
5A meeting
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Rebel-Fan-74
- Byrnes Rebels
- Posts: 3436
- Joined: Fri Feb 01, 2013 7:47 am
- Location: LA LA LAND
5A meeting
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ByrnesRebels05
- Byrnes Rebels
- Posts: 482
- Joined: Thu Aug 22, 2013 11:37 pm
Re: 5A meeting
Similar to basketball seeding it seems like. This also renders the first 6 games of the year, pointless.Rebel-Fan-74 wrote:From what I'm hearing, I don't like anything I've heard so far...
Top four from each Region no at large in Upper State
Lower State is different, but it all comes down to Region except for one at large and no one seems to know how the at large will be selected.
Pre-determined match ups...
Region One #1 -vs - Region Two #4
Region Three #2 -vs- Region Four #3
NO SEEDING!!!!
Meaning the best teams could meet in round one or round two.
Ten Games - Five rounds of Playoffs ( 32 team bracket )
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FootballFan4343
- HS Football Fanatic
- Posts: 406
- Joined: Wed Oct 22, 2014 7:31 am
Re: 5A meeting
What a terrible scenario. This scenario is going to make for some VERY inflated records, plus with the pre-determined match-ups you may see some teams not play certain teams. IE: NW-Byrnes since is almost guaranteed they would meet in the 2nd round of the playoffs. And yes, the non-region games are 100 percent pointless. At least in the NFL, College football, etc, you can play well out of division and conference and still make post-season. Conference is still the key to the playoffs/bowl, but other games matter too. In this scenario there is nothing good that comes out of the first 5-6 games. You play good teams then you risk injury and if you play bad teams, then you don't get any better. It would be interesting to see where certain coaches/ADs stand on this.Rebel-Fan-74 wrote:From what I'm hearing, I don't like anything I've heard so far...
Top four from each Region no at large in Upper State
Lower State is different, but it all comes down to Region except for one at large and no one seems to know how the at large will be selected.
Pre-determined match ups...
Region One #1 -vs - Region Two #4
Region Three #2 -vs- Region Four #3
NO SEEDING!!!!
Meaning the best teams could meet in round one or round two.
Ten Games - Five rounds of Playoffs ( 32 team bracket )
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Rebel-Fan-74
- Byrnes Rebels
- Posts: 3436
- Joined: Fri Feb 01, 2013 7:47 am
- Location: LA LA LAND
Re: 5A meeting
I'm told that Region 3 (Dorman, Spartanburg, Boiling Springs, Gaffney and Byrnes) were almost singing in unison on how this is "BAD FOR HIGH SCHOOL FOOTBALL" and even Knotts (Dutch Fork) was not in favor. However, the Lower State contingent had the ear of the Executive Committee and the committee kept saying one playoff format for ALL SPORTS PERIOD, END OF DISCUSSION!
Non Region games will be interesting to see how they work. Also, once Region Games start for others, the five team regions don't have anyone to schedule so who do they play? Unless Region 3 and Region 4 (RH,NW etc) agree on a deal, it could be tough finding a game.
..........8 team Region..................5 team Region
Week 01 NR Game..........................NR Game
Week 02 BYE.................................NR Game
Week 03 NR Game..........................NR Game
Week 04 NR Game..........................NR Game
Week 05 R Game............................NR Game
Week 06 R Game............................NR Game
Week 07 R Game............................BYE
Week 08 R Game............................R Game
Week 09 R Game............................R Game
Week 10 R Game............................R Game
Week 11 R Game............................R Game
Even if you have "willing opponents" who is available in Week 5, 6???? They are all playing REGION games... The only hope is a region nearby with odd number of teams willing to cross bracket... and this is what I think will happen. (Keep in mind, almost everyone is Region 2 this year that moves to 5A Region 3 played Gaffney and one of the other teams as well, Dorman played Gaffney and Rock Hill, Byrnes was NW and Gaffney, B. Springs was NF and Gaffney), so we may end up playing everyone in Region 3 and Region 4 making this a "10 team region".
Region 3
Boiling Springs, Byrnes, Dorman, Gaffney, Spartanburg
Region 4
Clover, Ft. Mill, Nation Ford, Northwestern, Rock Hill
Furthermore, let's say Byrnes goes 0-6 in non-region, but manages to win 1 Region Game and you end up with this:
Dorman..... 4-0
Spartanburg 3-1
B Springs.... 2-2
Byrnes....... 1-3
Gaffney..... 0-4
The 1-9 Rebels make the playoffs!
Yeah, we put a whole lot of thought into this one didn't we?
Why would an AD at those five schools do anything for Non-Region games? A top flight player would not play too much in non-region games... why risk him getting hurt before Region games? They don't count for anything...
You could take a group of 4th graders and come up with a better plan!
Non Region games will be interesting to see how they work. Also, once Region Games start for others, the five team regions don't have anyone to schedule so who do they play? Unless Region 3 and Region 4 (RH,NW etc) agree on a deal, it could be tough finding a game.
..........8 team Region..................5 team Region
Week 01 NR Game..........................NR Game
Week 02 BYE.................................NR Game
Week 03 NR Game..........................NR Game
Week 04 NR Game..........................NR Game
Week 05 R Game............................NR Game
Week 06 R Game............................NR Game
Week 07 R Game............................BYE
Week 08 R Game............................R Game
Week 09 R Game............................R Game
Week 10 R Game............................R Game
Week 11 R Game............................R Game
Even if you have "willing opponents" who is available in Week 5, 6???? They are all playing REGION games... The only hope is a region nearby with odd number of teams willing to cross bracket... and this is what I think will happen. (Keep in mind, almost everyone is Region 2 this year that moves to 5A Region 3 played Gaffney and one of the other teams as well, Dorman played Gaffney and Rock Hill, Byrnes was NW and Gaffney, B. Springs was NF and Gaffney), so we may end up playing everyone in Region 3 and Region 4 making this a "10 team region".
Region 3
Boiling Springs, Byrnes, Dorman, Gaffney, Spartanburg
Region 4
Clover, Ft. Mill, Nation Ford, Northwestern, Rock Hill
Furthermore, let's say Byrnes goes 0-6 in non-region, but manages to win 1 Region Game and you end up with this:
Dorman..... 4-0
Spartanburg 3-1
B Springs.... 2-2
Byrnes....... 1-3
Gaffney..... 0-4
The 1-9 Rebels make the playoffs!
Yeah, we put a whole lot of thought into this one didn't we?
Why would an AD at those five schools do anything for Non-Region games? A top flight player would not play too much in non-region games... why risk him getting hurt before Region games? They don't count for anything...
You could take a group of 4th graders and come up with a better plan!
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trojangrad78
- Northwestern Trojans
- Posts: 645
- Joined: Thu Aug 29, 2013 10:12 pm
Re: 5A meeting
This certainly ranks as one of the better decisions coming out of the SCHSL office.
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2002Patriot
- Fort Dorchester Patriots
- Posts: 63
- Joined: Fri Oct 09, 2015 9:03 pm
Re: 5A meeting
Rebel-Fan-74 wrote:From what I'm hearing, I don't like anything I've heard so far...
Top four from each Region no at large in Upper State
Lower State is different, but it all comes down to Region except for one at large and no one seems to know how the at large will be selected.
Pre-determined match ups...
Region One #1 -vs - Region Two #4
Region Three #2 -vs- Region Four #3
NO SEEDING!!!!
Meaning the best teams could meet in round one or round two.
Ten Games - Five rounds of Playoffs ( 32 team bracket )
It could be a bad or a good thing for the upper state teams. If there are 10 games and only region games matter, you can essentially relax the first half of the season and rest your good players until region time. By playoffs, they would all probably be clicking and you smash the lower state/Columbia teams. Region 7 (Charleston region) will have 7 region games and pretty much their whole season will be a region season. They could either really banged up when the playoffs approach or really in sync.
There really needs to be seeding though. 32 team brackets seems like a good idea but with 41 teams why not just include them all and give the "top seeds" or best records like a bye before the 32? A play in like the NCAA tournament for the other 9 teams? You're bound to have teams with bad records get in so why not just include them all....lol Pre-determined match-ups is just setting things up to have teams possibly throw games to avoid a possible first round game with a certain team.
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Rebel-Fan-74
- Byrnes Rebels
- Posts: 3436
- Joined: Fri Feb 01, 2013 7:47 am
- Location: LA LA LAND
Re: 5A meeting
trojangrad78 wrote:This certainly ranks as one of the better decisions coming out of the SCHSL office.
So that is what the sarcasm font looks like...
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trojangrad78
- Northwestern Trojans
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- Joined: Thu Aug 29, 2013 10:12 pm
Re: 5A meeting
As for football state championships 4A D1 (Big 16) per http://www.scfootballhistory.com" target="_blank
This is just statistical information I call hmmmmmm....
1990 - 2014 (25 years-50 teams)
31 Upstate vs 19 Lowerstate teams played in the games
21 Upstate champions vs 4 Lowerstate champions
16 Upstate vs Lowerstate games with 13 Upstate victories vs 3 Lowerstate victories
8 Upstate vs Upstate games
1 Lowerstate vs Lowerstate game
This is just statistical information I call hmmmmmm....
1990 - 2014 (25 years-50 teams)
31 Upstate vs 19 Lowerstate teams played in the games
21 Upstate champions vs 4 Lowerstate champions
16 Upstate vs Lowerstate games with 13 Upstate victories vs 3 Lowerstate victories
8 Upstate vs Upstate games
1 Lowerstate vs Lowerstate game
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Dave Pickren
- SC HS Football Historian
- Posts: 256
- Joined: Mon Sep 02, 2013 10:56 pm
Re: 5A meeting
I simply can not believe that the 4A now "5A" schools are willing to give up the 11th game and a 6th home game every other season.
Even in a bad gate of 3000, Times $6 a head equals 18K plus concessions.
At Dorman they sell out 3500 season tix so that is $24,500 GUARANTEED plus whatever buys at the gate plus general admission, students and visiting fans. Let' say $40K in gates receipt plus concessions. Choose the right opponent and it could easily be double that.
You can buy alot of girls softball bats and volleyball nets with $40K.
Even in a bad gate of 3000, Times $6 a head equals 18K plus concessions.
At Dorman they sell out 3500 season tix so that is $24,500 GUARANTEED plus whatever buys at the gate plus general admission, students and visiting fans. Let' say $40K in gates receipt plus concessions. Choose the right opponent and it could easily be double that.
You can buy alot of girls softball bats and volleyball nets with $40K.
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FootballFan4343
- HS Football Fanatic
- Posts: 406
- Joined: Wed Oct 22, 2014 7:31 am
Re: 5A meeting
Called a couple of friends today and here is what I found out. Looks like the schools that don't routinely compete for state titles were behind the change. These schools were tired of playing tough non-region schedules for "points" and then ending the season with a 3-8 record. Instead, as it sits now, they could in theory, play a bunch of 1A-3A schools, have a 6-0 non region record, win one region game, which would put them in the playoffs, and they are 7-3. Even with a first round loss, they still go 7-4 or 6-5 worst case with a playoff berth. That looks a whole lot better than 5-7 or 4-8. So those 30 or so schools that know, realistically, they won't compete for state championships, instead aim for winning records.
From my understanding the Region 2 teams, along with Northwestern, Fort Dorchester, Stratford, Summerville, Dutch Fork were the only real ones against the current plan. So basically the teams that feel they have shots at state championships.
Your point about a 1-9 team making the playoffs is a valid point, and that may happen. Plus, what about non-region games. With the preset playoff "pods", why would Byrnes schedule a NW or Dutch Fork, knowing they will almost certainly meet in the playoffs due to cross bracketing not happening. Obviously for a gate, but we all know no one wants to play a good opponent twice in a season, ESPECIALLY if you won the first time around.
I too am absolutely FLOORED that 4A schools are giving up the 11th game and potential revenue. Easily leaving 25-30k on the table. Even the WORST 4A teams clear 10-12k for a home football game. Keep in mind that NO OTHER sport actually makes money in this state, the other sports actually operate off the money football brings in. I am sure at some schools, basketball might make money, but as a whole, in South Carolina, football is the only that actually turns a profit.
From my understanding the Region 2 teams, along with Northwestern, Fort Dorchester, Stratford, Summerville, Dutch Fork were the only real ones against the current plan. So basically the teams that feel they have shots at state championships.
Your point about a 1-9 team making the playoffs is a valid point, and that may happen. Plus, what about non-region games. With the preset playoff "pods", why would Byrnes schedule a NW or Dutch Fork, knowing they will almost certainly meet in the playoffs due to cross bracketing not happening. Obviously for a gate, but we all know no one wants to play a good opponent twice in a season, ESPECIALLY if you won the first time around.
I too am absolutely FLOORED that 4A schools are giving up the 11th game and potential revenue. Easily leaving 25-30k on the table. Even the WORST 4A teams clear 10-12k for a home football game. Keep in mind that NO OTHER sport actually makes money in this state, the other sports actually operate off the money football brings in. I am sure at some schools, basketball might make money, but as a whole, in South Carolina, football is the only that actually turns a profit.