Ad blocker detected: Our website is made possible by displaying online advertisements to our visitors. Please consider supporting us by disabling your ad blocker on our website.
what's your reaction to people who sit during the anthem, as I have seen fans do at high school football games? Is that showing bravery?
Interesting question. I will admit to personally being one of those who sat through the anthem at times. But, I did so out of medical necessity, not as a point of protest. I would feel that a person sitting as a point of protest, would be entitled to my respect for their belief in whatever they were choosing to protest. It is peaceful, although no respectful in my opinion.
As Ken mentioned above, (he posted it before I had the chance) the best option is to not play the anthem at events. At football games, the second best option would be to play it before the team runouts (someone mentioned this in something that I read).
Let me just say this, before judging what another person does, or does not do, try to remember that the other person has their own reasons for their actions, reasons that you may not understand (see Colin Kaepernick). And they also have the same Constitutional Rights as you do. When it comes to what each of us feels is the "right" or "proper" response to a given situation, we are all going to have our own opinions. And those opinions should never be allowed to cloud our judgement of how another person reacts. We have laws and regulations to determine legal from illegal. Opinions do not change those. Just my thoughts on the issue. Again, I choose to stand for the Anthem, but I do not pretend that what I do will be the best thing for another person. And thanks Cavalier Eagle. I appreciate you understanding, even if you disagree.
The "Godfather" didn't whine like The "Slobfather" is doing, when he got INDICTED!!!!!
not one soldier has fought for our freedom in the 4 wars ( 5 if you include desert storm as a war ) since that day……
But our presence, folks like your son in law and I, went a LOOOOOOOONG way in maintaining those freedoms. And that "little song" means a whole lot to me.
what's your reaction to people who sit during the anthem, as I have seen fans do at high school football games? Is that showing bravery?
Interesting question. I will admit to personally being one of those who sat through the anthem at times. But, I did so out of medical necessity, not as a point of protest. I would feel that a person sitting as a point of protest, would be entitled to my respect for their belief in whatever they were choosing to protest. It is peaceful, although no respectful in my opinion.
As Ken mentioned above, (he posted it before I had the chance) the best option is to not play the anthem at events. At football games, the second best option would be to play it before the team runouts (someone mentioned this in something that I read).
Let me just say this, before judging what another person does, or does not do, try to remember that the other person has their own reasons for their actions, reasons that you may not understand (see Colin Kaepernick). And they also have the same Constitutional Rights as you do. When it comes to what each of us feels is the "right" or "proper" response to a given situation, we are all going to have our own opinions. And those opinions should never be allowed to cloud our judgement of how another person reacts. We have laws and regulations to determine legal from illegal. Opinions do not change those. Just my thoughts on the issue. Again, I choose to stand for the Anthem, but I do not pretend that what I do will be the best thing for another person. And thanks Cavalier Eagle. I appreciate you understanding, even if you disagree.
not one soldier has fought for our freedom in the 4 wars ( 5 if you include desert storm as a war ) since that day……
But our presence, folks like your son in law and I, went a LOOOOOOOONG way in maintaining those freedoms. And that "little song" means a whole lot to me.
I don't think I've seen a more civil discourse on PFT or SCPreptalk about such a controversial topic. What I sense is an immense amount of respect being shown from both sides of this debate and in the middle.
I personally LOVE the anthem. To go back to the roots of the song and debase it seems pointless and irrelavant although I will admit to being ignorant of the origins of this song and intrigued by a well worded discussion of it's history.
It wasn't introduced in my life time as a citizen of this great nation. I've put in a lot of thought about the subject. I didn't enlist. I came close. As in the recruiter was calling me one night to pack a bag and meet him in the morning. I was at a crossroads in my life. Having pursued a musical career in a band that gained enough success and fans to be affirming to me, I still fell short of attaining that goal. Because I'd chosen that route over college I suddenly felt a bit lost and unsure what to do next.
My nature is to probe and explore different possibilties and roads in life. So one day I walked into the recruiting office at the mall and just started talking to them. Every branch just to hear what they had to say and to see if they could sell me on the idea. For the record, my mind was very open to the idea and he was doing the best he could but the recruiter pushed a little too hard and I backed away. I really don't like being leaned on or feeling coerced to make important decisions one way or the other. I probably should have given it a shot. I believe it would have built structures in my nature like a lattice for a grapevine that could have allowed me to be much further ahead in life and to flourish instead of languishing around on the ground. Not sure I've ever talked to anyone who served who regretted it although it breaks my heart to see wounded vets and it's especially crushing to see a grave.
Honestly it's a hard thing for me to square with. Robert Heinlein wrote an outline of a future America where you did not have to enlist but you could not vote if you did not. The logical thinking being that if you aren't willing to put your life on the line then you abdicate representation to those who are. This seems logical to me. Especially when you consider how many non voters we have in the country.
As such, with issues that deal with patriotism and symbols of it, I always tread lightly around those who did or do serve. As I understand it it's my right to have an opinion on the issue. Maybe it's my right to have an aggressive opinion but I do not choose to approach it that way and won't approach it that way. I'll run it up the flagpole and see who salutes, pun definitely intended. But I defer to those who enlisted.
I have more to say on the issue....but it'd be the longest post I ever made.
“Win as if you were used to it, lose as if you enjoyed it for a change.” ~ Ralph Waldo Emerson
I don't think I've seen a more civil discourse on PFT or SCPreptalk about such a controversial topic. What I sense is an immense amount of respect being shown from both sides of this debate and in the middle.
I personally LOVE the anthem. To go back to the roots of the song and debase it seems pointless and irrelavant although I will admit to being ignorant of the origins of this song and intrigued by a well worded discussion of it's history.
It wasn't introduced in my life time as a citizen of this great nation. I've put in a lot of thought about the subject. I didn't enlist. I came close. As in the recruiter was calling me one night to pack a bag and meet him in the morning. I was at a crossroads in my life. Having pursued a musical career in a band that gained enough success and fans to be affirming to me, I still fell short of attaining that goal. Because I'd chosen that route over college I suddenly felt a bit lost and unsure what to do next.
My nature is to probe and explore different possibilties and roads in life. So one day I walked into the recruiting office at the mall and just started talking to them. Every branch just to hear what they had to say and to see if they could sell me on the idea. For the record, my mind was very open to the idea and he was doing the best he could but the recruiter pushed a little too hard and I backed away. I really don't like being leaned on or feeling coerced to make important decisions one way or the other. I probably should have given it a shot. I believe it would have built structures in my nature like a lattice for a grapevine that could have allowed me to be much further ahead in life and to flourish instead of languishing around on the ground. Not sure I've ever talked to anyone who served who regretted it although it breaks my heart to see wounded vets and it's especially crushing to see a grave.
Honestly it's a hard thing for me to square with. Robert Heinlein wrote an outline of a future America where you did not have to enlist but you could not vote if you did not. The logical thinking being that if you aren't willing to put your life on the line then you abdicate representation to those who are. This seems logical to me. Especially when you consider how many non voters we have in the country.
As such, with issues that deal with patriotism and symbols of it, I always tread lightly around those who did or do serve. As I understand it it's my right to have an opinion on the issue. Maybe it's my right to have an aggressive opinion but I do not choose to approach it that way and won't approach it that way. I'll run it up the flagpole and see who salutes, pun definitely intended. But I defer to those who enlisted.
I have more to say on the issue....but it'd be the longest post I ever made.
Decav, I have a young friend that is a school teacher. Back to his great or either great great grandfather and forward to him, all have served in the military. The men that is. He stopped the trend. He questioned his decision. I gave him my opinion. It's not for everyone. I couldn't be a teacher. It's not in me. That doesn't make teaching less important. I remember when we first moved to Columbia. We had never had a garbage man. I told my kids, never look down on those men. If they don't do the job, we'll have to. There is no one job more important than the other. Kinda like your hands. You need each finger. One is no more important than the other. They each serve a purpose. If you lose one, it makes it harder on the others. We're all in this together. We each serve a purpose. We need each other. I just hate that it takes us so many years to realize that!
"I don't think I've seen a more civil discourse on PFT or SCPreptalk about such a controversial topic. What I sense is an immense amount of respect being shown from both sides of this debate and in the middle." (Decav)
Decav, I am probably the most progressive, open minded, poster on this site. Believe it or not, I try to understand all sides of an issue before I post. Sometimes that is hard to do. But when it comes to respecting and honoring our country and it's symbols and traditions, it is my belief that there is no one-size-fits-all answer. Opinions are as varied on this topic as there are people. No matter how much you love your government, or hate it, I have ran across very few people in my lifetime, who do not love their country.
Having had family members who were military, and being from the middle of downtown jugghead central, I grew up viewing most every action in this country, from a military point of view. I was taught at an early age about respecting the flag, the anthem, the pledge of allegiance. I was born in 1957 and grew up in the 1960s. Remember that those were the most contentious years ever. The Civil Rights Act, Vietnam War, The killings of MLK, JFK, RFK. Kent State Massacre. Flower Children. All of those things were constantly pulling at your conscious. It was extremely hard to know what was right and what was wrong. The best thing that I got out of all of this was the ability to see things from all sides.
Forward to my High School years in the mid 1970s. I was the captain of the Debate Team. See, I have been an argumentative type for decades. Pick a topic, choose a side. Let's argue. I find that in my adult life, I am always "that guy" who goes against the grain just to see if someone else has even considered learning about what he finds himself arguing for, or against. Most of the time, I find that they have not done so. The art of compromise is dependent upon the ability to understand where your opponent is coming from. What is helping him to form his opinions.
Back to where we are today. Not very many open minded people on this website. Or at PFT back in the day. 98% of the people here, see a post of mine, and they shut down all logical thinking, and immediately go into attack mode. I understand that. When Cavalier Eagle said to me, what he said the other day, I was pleased to no ends. He didn't agree with my post, but he respected my opinions. That is what I have been trying to get to on this site, for 5 or 6 years now. All of us are here because we love High School Football. But we all are different on other things. This website has been successful because of our mutual love of the game. As others come to respect each other for their opinions about other topics, it will only get stronger. Everyone does not have to hold the same opinions in order to get along. Ken made a post about this a couple of weeks back. I think that it was deleted, as so many of them are on this site. It seems as if Easley Guy is afraid of differing opinions. Some back and forth on topics is not a bad thing. Only when people try to make it personal. You have never been disrespectful to me, and I hope that you can say the same about me. But there are some people here, no names, that take an opinion different from their own, as a personal insult. Nothing could be farther from the truth as far as I am concerned. Life would be a very boring waste of time if we were all just alike.
Thank you for your always insightful posts, your peaceful demeanor, and your abilities to converse. And thanks again to Cavalier Eagle for understanding that bigger picture and his insightful opinions.
The "Godfather" didn't whine like The "Slobfather" is doing, when he got INDICTED!!!!!
"I don't think I've seen a more civil discourse on PFT or SCPreptalk about such a controversial topic. What I sense is an immense amount of respect being shown from both sides of this debate and in the middle." (Decav)
Decav, I am probably the most progressive, open minded, poster on this site. Believe it or not, I try to understand all sides of an issue before I post. Sometimes that is hard to do. But when it comes to respecting and honoring our country and it's symbols and traditions, it is my belief that there is no one-size-fits-all answer. Opinions are as varied on this topic as there are people. No matter how much you love your government, or hate it, I have ran across very few people in my lifetime, who do not love their country.
Having had family members who were military, and being from the middle of downtown jugghead central, I grew up viewing most every action in this country, from a military point of view. I was taught at an early age about respecting the flag, the anthem, the pledge of allegiance. I was born in 1957 and grew up in the 1960s. Remember that those were the most contentious years ever. The Civil Rights Act, Vietnam War, The killings of MLK, JFK, RFK. Kent State Massacre. Flower Children. All of those things were constantly pulling at your conscious. It was extremely hard to know what was right and what was wrong. The best thing that I got out of all of this was the ability to see things from all sides.
Forward to my High School years in the mid 1970s. I was the captain of the Debate Team. See, I have been an argumentative type for decades. Pick a topic, choose a side. Let's argue. I find that in my adult life, I am always "that guy" who goes against the grain just to see if someone else has even considered learning about what he finds himself arguing for, or against. Most of the time, I find that they have not done so. The art of compromise is dependent upon the ability to understand where your opponent is coming from. What is helping him to form his opinions.
Back to where we are today. Not very many open minded people on this website. Or at PFT back in the day. 98% of the people here, see a post of mine, and they shut down all logical thinking, and immediately go into attack mode. I understand that. When Cavalier Eagle said to me, what he said the other day, I was pleased to no ends. He didn't agree with my post, but he respected my opinions. That is what I have been trying to get to on this site, for 5 or 6 years now. All of us are here because we love High School Football. But we all are different on other things. This website has been successful because of our mutual love of the game. As others come to respect each other for their opinions about other topics, it will only get stronger. Everyone does not have to hold the same opinions in order to get along. Ken made a post about this a couple of weeks back. I think that it was deleted, as so many of them are on this site. It seems as if Easley Guy is afraid of differing opinions. Some back and forth on topics is not a bad thing. Only when people try to make it personal. You have never been disrespectful to me, and I hope that you can say the same about me. But there are some people here, no names, that take an opinion different from their own, as a personal insult. Nothing could be farther from the truth as far as I am concerned. Life would be a very boring waste of time if we were all just alike.
Thank you for your always insightful posts, your peaceful demeanor, and your abilities to converse. And thanks again to Cavalier Eagle for understanding that bigger picture and his insightful opinions.
I appreciate it Brother! I'll tell y'all something, no joke. I don't even agree with myself all the time. I remember at one time I didn't like Mexicans. My sister married one. I'm not a two faced person, so I told him and his brothers that we wouldn't be friends, but that I wouldn't be rude to them. I didn't like this feeling, but I just couldn't help it. It took me 2 or 3 years before my feelings changed. When they changed, I went back and apologized to all of them. I could have pretended to like them, but that's just not the kind of man I am. I like for people to let me know where I stand with them and vice versa. So, my biggest disagreements are always with myself. Differing opinions have always helped me grow in life. I'm really enjoying this thread.
CavEagle, I understand how you feel. I've always felt that being honest with someone is better than living a lie. I upset some of my family by speaking my mind about my brother getting married, but after a couple of years, everyone found out that I was telling the truth. Keeping quiet and pretending everything was alright just rubbed me the wrong way. Yeah, it made folks mad at the time, but later...
And that policy leads me to speak my mind here as well. I don't do it to be mean or upset anyone, but as mentioned above, exchanging different points of view help solve issues not bury them. I wish we could be open and honest with each other on some issues that need to just go away. But we try to be Politically Correct and not offend anyone. Why do we have a BLACK LIVES MATTER? That should be as clear as day, all lives matter. Why do we need any law or movement to tell us that we need to value or neighbors. Why do we continue to focus on issues that divide us and not focus on the ways we are alike? Because the media and the politicians keep us focused on those issues. It's time we as individuals take back control of our lives.
We talk about TERM LIMITS and how we need them.... news flash, we've had term limits from the very beginning. It's called re-election. Quit voting for them to go back, and start supporting and voting for folks we need. Yes, it is hard to find a good candidate now, and I guess it will be harder as we move forward. They've got so much control now that it will be difficult to get them out. And if a good person wanted wanted to run for office; they would get ambushed by the "establishment" and by next week, their reputation would be smeared, videos of them in bed with someone, etc, etc and etc.
Sorry, I'm just fed up with things tonight. It just makes me angry that we are still working on issues that should have been distant memories. Why do we have to keep living in the past???? I mean if I can have friends that are Gaffney Indians and even a dad gum Dorman fan, why can't we move on?
